Tuesday, October 04, 2005

Case Study

Sometimes it is just too good.

1. How the right-right wing thinks. This is a former policymaker with an outrageous and morally reprehensible idea harkening back to the eugenics experiments of darker and bygone days.

2. How the right-right wing talks about what they think when they think noone who disagrees with them is listening. This is that same former policymaker with his own radio show.

3. How the right-right wing lies about what they said they think when they realize they gave too much away, and really real Americans have taken exception to their outrageous and morally reprehensible ideas.

4. How the right-right wing blames liberals for coming up with those outrageous and morally reprehensible ideas in the first place, even though liberals didn't come up with those ideas at all.

5. How the right-right wing blames the media for all of this and never has to apologize or take repsonsiblity for whisperin' you know what.

And it is all wrapped up in the same article for your convenience, including refrences and an internet roundup!

Have fun!


ruby booth said...

At least it narrows down what to get Bennett as a Christmas present.

Corwyn said...


He's right.

In a purely, hypothetical, statistical sense, of course... :)

S.A.W.B. said...

Like Corwyn said, he's right.

If you were to abort all the unborn black babies, the crime rate would likely drop, as there would no longer be an entire segment of the population available to commit the crimes.

Conversely, if one was to abort all the white, asian, hispanic, eskimo, etc, unborn babies, then the crime rate would decrease as well.

Would the decrease in the crime rate be comparable to the current statistics? I don't think so. I'm entirely confident that if one were to eliminate a segment of the population, that some of our more opportunistic residents would be more than happy to fill in the gaps.

What Bill Bennett said was entirely true on a base level. Was it an exceedingly poor choice of words? Yep. Is it making the right in this country look like morons? For a couple of days, just until the next scandal on the left rolls around, which it already has.

Stay tuned kids...

Dante said...

This is a case of the apologists making things worse instead of better. Instead of all this hoopla over what Bennett really meant, the "right-right" should just not be making a big deal out of the situation. The best defense here is no defense at all.

Bennett made a racist comment. He took the abortion = lower crime rate argument from Freakanomics and took it one step further by substituting poor people (the book's argument) with black people (Bennett's argument). This isn't as bad as wearing sheets and buring crosses, but it's definately along the lines of negroes stole our dates.

My guess is that if there weren't a peep from anyone on the right about this comment, the media would harp on it past the point of interest for most people. A lot of people would get tired of hearing it.

The right still hasn't managed to grasp that they're seen as the "regular guys" now. Once upon a time, you were rich or Democrat. Now you're a Socialist or a Repulican. That's not entirely true, but that's how it's being seen. This could easily be played as the big bad media making a mountain out of a molehill.

The right should take the attitude that this radio show guy Bennett (who's a little racist) made a comment he really shouldn't have and the left-wing media wants to lynch him over it. Bennett is a smart guy. Too bad he has that racist streak in him.

That's a regular guy attitude to take towards this. That wouldn't necessarilly make this go away, but it would save us a lot of hassle and get this story off the headlines. It wouldn't win hearts and minds, but it would certainly do more good than the media covering each of the daily reinterpretations of what Bennett said. This isn't the proudest moment for the right in general. Let's just do what we can to get it out of the news.

Patrick Armstrong said...

Corwyn, you're smarter than that.

The smiley on the end of the last statement proves it. LOL.

But I have a hard time letting that one go even in a purely hypothetical, statistical sense.

Cause I think Bennett's wrong in every sense.

Sooo wrong, in fact, that I'm gonna beat this dead horse like it owes me money. I hope you will understand....:)

In the article I first refrenced, there were links to the actual studies that Bennett later claimed were the foundations of what he said.

Regarding race as they relate to those studies, you can find the reference here. The most important passage, in my opinion, is below, and I have added the bold for emphasis:

"It is true that, on average, crime involvement in the U.S. is higher among blacks than whites. Importantly, however, once you control for income, the likelihood of growing up in a female-headed household, having a teenage mother, and how urban the environment is, the importance of race disappears for all crimes except homicide. (The homicide gap is partly explained by crack markets). In other words, for most crimes a white person and a black person who grow up next door to each other with similar incomes and the same family structure would be predicted to have the same crime involvement."

Is Bennett a racist? I don't know, but he may be taking his cues a little too much from what he sees on TV. It is the game of percentages and publicity that puts a black face on crime in this country. In terms of sheer numbers, more white people commit crimes than any other ethnic group. Why? Because there are a whole lot more white people in this country than anyone else.

And that's before you even consider how the "crime rate" is skewed by non-reported or non-prosectued crimes, and what those have to do with race.

What I think is most telling is that Bennett has gone to such lengths to deny he said it. That is something I take pride in: in America, if you dish it out, you've got to be able to take it.

Now, if Mr Bennett was really as smart as he thinks he is, he would have wrapped his political philosophy into his response, and we wouldn't be talking about this at all: "Yeah, I was wrong for saying that," said Mr. Bennett today on Meet the Press, "the only population that has a 0% crimerate in America is the unborn of any race! I didn't mean to offend any of them with my remarks."

Patrick Armstrong said...

I like how the most insightful comment so far has been from Dante:

"The right still hasn't managed to grasp that they're seen as the "regular guys" now. Once upon a time, you were rich or Democrat. Now you're a Socialist or a Repulican. That's not entirely true, but that's how it's being seen. This could easily be played as the big bad media making a mountain out of a molehill."

Which is exactly what this is. But SAWB is right, this will go away, just like the 'Rush Limbaugh doesn't like Donovan McNabb because he's black' & 'Pat Robertson wants the US government to kill elected leaders he doesn't like' things went away.

Unless they keep Cindy 'Shenanigan' Sheehan in jail, that is...

Dante said...

You act like you didn't expect that, Pat :)

Too bad you went and lumped this in with Limbaugh, though. This is a little different than Rush's McNabb statement. Rush NEVER said he didn't like McNabb because he's black. Rush said that he didn't think McNabb was a very good QB (and at the time McNabb's stats weren't compelling either way). He then said that the only reason the media hypes McNabb up to be a good QB is because he is black. Rush basically called sports writers racist and the media turned it around to look like Rush didn't like McNabb because he was black. Given the media's absolute love affair with Kordell Stewart a few years earlier (who was the QB for Rush's favorite team), I can see why he might get that attitude.

Buzzzbee said...

Technically s.a.w.b. is wrong on his comment that the crime rate would drop if you aborted all the white fetuses. The number of crimes committed would drop, but the crime rate refers to the "ratio of crimes in an area to the population of that area; expressed per 1000 population per year"-freedictionary.com I looked it up just to be sure I was right. Bennett's comment is correct. That's the problem. We're getting really pissed off at this guy who said something that is statistically true. As someone who grew up after the "real" civil rights movement, I'm really tired of the double standard. It seems as though if you're black you can say anything you want about race as long as it's against white people. If you're white you can say anything you want about race as long as it's against white people. Bennett's comments were distastful, but true. Hey, look on the bright-side Patrick, I may be further to the right than you after all.

Patrick Armstrong said...

No, kids, what he said wasn't even statistically true. I agree totally with Dante on how homeboy showed his stripes by confusing poor with black.

Again, I will reiterate that what is actually considered crime and what crimes are prosecuted are just as important in this debate.

I don't know a single black person who has been able to get out of a ticket or a minor crime. I'm sure there are some, somewhere, but I don't know them. On the other hand, I know whiteboys and girls who have cried or yelled their way out of DUI's, intent to distribute violations, and arson.

I even think back to the days when I had long hair and dressed like a criminal. I got pulled over. I got stopped by the cops. I got ignored by people at counters and banks and waitstaff and looked at like I was a felon. I cut my hair and wear a collared shirt. Boom! "Yes, sir" is my new name.

I wonder what would have happened if my skin was a different color. I can cut my hair, after all.

As far as being OK to criticize the majority, that's kind of what you do when you are rebellious. That would be the Modus Operandi, if you will. Minority populations outside of the Wall Street and Hollywood elite control very little, and criticism is directed at those who pull the strings, not against those who the string pulls.

Mr Bennett crossed the line into the darker parts of history called "eugenics," and we have a dirty little secret that down here in the South: some state governments actually tried to get away with keeping blacks from reproducing. So yeah, I take exception to homeboy saying stuff like that.

Besides, if we did what he said to do, all it would mean is that the white population in this country would have to find someone else to blame for what we get away with.

Buzzzbee said...

Sorry to see you traded in the "bloody-nose" for a bleeding heart. Yes, in fact, he was technically correct. Blacks commit a higher percentage of crime than whites. Therefore, less blacks=lower crime rate. That's what a crime rate is, it's a ratio, not a total. The crime rate is basically the percentage of crime only it's over 1000, instead of 100.

That's not to say that the solution to the crime problem in our country is to abort all the black babies, but the idea that you have to apologize for having an unpopular opinion is ridiculous to me. It's almost a crime to think or say anything that offends someone else in this country.

As far as what your life would be like if your skin was a different color, don't worry, there will always be plenty of white people like yourself in this country who will excuse any illegal behavior you happen to be involved in by blaming everything from your unfortunate economic status, to the old standard "it's the white man's fault". I can tell you from experience, as someone who grew up poor, that committing a crime is always a choice, and I can assure you that 99.99% of those "unfortunate" people in prison aren't there for stealing bread or medicine. They're coke dealers and carjackers and murders and the like. I've got 4 friends who are or were prison guards, and they laugh at the claim that most of these guys are anything less than Criminals. I do wonder though, what your opinion of me would be if I were in prison. If I had made the choice to steal, or sell coke instead of getting a job at 16, and going to college. I grew up in a poor neighborhood, in a poor family, but I'm not black. So, I wonder if you would feel sorry for me. Those people took the easy way out, don't ever fool yourself by calling it anything else. When you do, you belittle the struggle that people like myself and yes, those black people who grew up in the same socio-economic conditions as those who turned to crime, but instead chose the more difficult path.

Patrick Armstrong said...

I haven't traded in my bloody nose for a bleeding heart, buddy, I'm just wearing the sheep's clothing. Here come the fangs.

Where the difference of fact comes in is that the crime rate (ratio) has nothing to do with crimes committed (number) and crimes prosecuted (the important number).

"Crime rate" is fuzzy math. Especially when you look specifically at populations. You're looking for tendencies, not overall numbers, and that gives you a skewed idea of who committs crimes.

I'm not saying that folks in prison shouldn't be in prison because they didn't commit crimes. I'm definitely not saying that anyone who commits a crime is excused for doing so because of the color of their skin. I'm saying that there are criminals who are guilty of the same crimes as those in jail who are never prosecuted, or given much lighter sentences. I'm saying that there are people who are excused for their crimes based on the color of their skin, and that skin color is white, white, white.

Why are they prosecuted less? Why are they given lighter sentences? Because their skin color looks like yours and mine.

Eliminating a section of the population based on skin color would keep the crime rate even, because then police would have to actually start prosecuting different folks whom they let slide now. They wouldn't be able to let as many crackers like you and me slip through the net. As a matter of fact, they would land heaviest on us because our Daddies aren't judges or real estate developers or big name doctors or big business owners.

And we're Democrats...you know how they do it down in Texas.

Therein lies the difference, I'm not excusing any crime, I'm just tellin' that there are folks out there who are 'practiced at turnin' their heads' when it comes to who gets the book thrown at them all the way, and who gets their wrist tapped with it.

Crime rate has nothing to do with actual crimes committed. Crime rate is relative.

And, for the record, we go after Bennett not because he has an 'unpopular' and 'incorrect' opinion, but because he was a person in power that has now shown that he beleives crime is somehow related to skin color alone, when we have proven again and again that crime is related to millions of sociological factors: the biggest of which is personal choice. Which shows me that he's practiced at turnin' his head.

His opinion is an intolerant opinion, excusing people who aren't black for their crimes, and placing all blame on a black face.

Sorry to relate this to some of y'all out there, but there are just as many white criminals as black criminals, regardless of what the numbers say. The numbers are just reflexive of who gets caught.